Another German Drilling - Krupp-

[mike ford]

Tau,
You shouldn't have much trouble finding cases for your drilling. Norma, RWS, and Z&B all make 8x57IRS and these cases can be used to load 8x57IR ammo. As a bonus, if either you or your Government insist on having a headstamp showing the correct caliber, you can simply take the "S"off. You can also make cases from 7x57R, 6.5x57R, 7x65R, or 9.3x74R. The 444 Marlin has the correct headsize, but I would only use it if I couldn't find some of the above named cases. The 444 is simi-rimmed(rather than rimmed)and may sometimes slip behind the extractor.Bullets (318") may be harder to find, but are avaliable from Buffalo Arms, as well as others. I use normal 8mm Mauser dies to load my 8x57 I and IR by simply removing the expander button( or replacing it with a smaller one, so the depriming pin stays in). A sizing die sizes the neck smaller than necessary and the expander opens it back up.The difference is usually enough to hold a .318 bullet.As mentioned earlier, you may be able to use .321 or .323" bullets anyway.
Mike

[Tau]

So at last I have received my license from the Police. I have cleaned the rifle and I do not think that she needs more restoration work or reblueing etc.

[Tau]

[Tau]

I love the switch to select Sprei and Koegel



And the flip up sights for when K is selected.

[Tau]

My second rifle with EAW mounts. I don't get art, but this is art for mesometing with function that is pretty.

[sharps4590]

Congratulations Tau!!! That's a nice piece and I really like the oak leaf engraving. May I ask what kind of scope came with it?

Now the real fun begins, working up loads for it then putting it to use!

[Tau]

It is a old German 1-4x ?? Scope. I will have a look tonight.
I have purchased 40 7x57 R RWS rounds that I will pull the bullets and then anneal and resize in a 8x57 die.
I still need to get the barrel slugged to insure it is .318 and not .323 before I can purchase bullets. However I have enough "shooting" rifles this one comes out during visits from my hunting friends around a fire. I must say I am super proud of this rifle and love the look on people's faces when they open the chamber for the first time and realise that there is 3 barrels.

[Axel E]

Wish good luck in reforming 7x57R to 8x57IR! Unless your chamber is slightly oversize or your cases slightly undersize, unlikely with RWS, it will not work. Contrary to popular belief, the 7x57R is not simply an 8x57IR necked down. Both base and rim nominal dimensions are slightly bigger: Base diameter 8x57IR = .469", 7x57R = .474", rim diam. 8 = .534", 7 = .531", rim thickness 8 = .055", 7 = .063". Further, RWS brass usually is thicker in the shoulder area than in the neck. Opening up part of the shoulder will produce a "donut" on the neck, requiring neck reaming or turning. So if your chamber is close to minimum and your brass close to max, simple resizing of the cases will not be sufficient. Better get some 8x57IRS brass.

[mike ford]

Tau,
Axel is correct that 8x57IRS cases are easier to use, plus you can correct the headstamp by taking the "S"off. Cases can be made from 7x57R cases, if they are what you have.However, as a 7x57R shooter, myself, I would be hesitant to give up 40 expensive cartridges in order to gain 40 cases. I can understand your eagerness to use your rifle so offer the following to help. First of all, do not pull the bullets from all the 7x57R cartridges at once, only pull one to start with. The first step is to see if the case will chamber( for myself, I would try this with a cartridge, but can't encourage this). If it won't chamber, the task is to determine where the interference(s) is (are). The first thing to check is the rim diameter. With the barrels off, see if the rim will seat into the rimrecess, upside down. If it does, good, then see if it obviously "stands proud" of the surface. If it dosen't, work the diameter down to fit, by any way convenient method( a lathe is not necessary at this stage). Then, check to see if it stands proud, as above. If the rim stands proud, thin it to be "flush" or slighly less,by any convenient means. Then try, again, to chamber the case. If it chambers, put the barrels back on and insure they will close on the case. If it won't close, work the barrels closed and open, several times. If there is a smooth bright spot on the bottom edge of the rim, the rim is still too thick and must be thinned again. If the case will not enter the chamber enough to allow the above checks, the interference is somewhere at the body of the cartridge. As Axel mentioned the 8mm and 7mm are based on two different headsized cases(m88 vs m93),so the next logical location to check is at the head. With a candle(or better yet, a butane lighter) lightly smoke the case( if you are hesitant to heat a primed case, use dykem or a black magic marker). Force the case into the chamber( finger pressure). When you remove the case, the smoke or other spotting media, will be worn off in the area of interference. If the interference is in the body of the case, the "fix" is a little more complicated. Since you are starting with an unfired case, interference at the body is less likely than if you started with a fired case.Recently, I went through this "drill" with seeing if 6.5x57R cases could be made from 7x57R fired cases.With 7x57R cases fired in my rifle, I made a case that worked in my 6.5x57R, by full length sizing and thinning the rim. Due to tolerances, reducung the diameter of the original rim was not required. These were my cases and my rifles, so there is no guarntee that it will be the same with your rifle. On the other hand, you may only have to fireform and check the length to obtain cases.The "donut" mentioned above is worthy of checking, but isn't likely in this case, because the neck will be expanded and shortened in fireforming.If all this doesn't work, we can try again. Unless you have a free source of 7x57R ammo or a lot "on hand", it would be much cheaper, as well as easier, to just buy 8x57IRS cases.
Mike

[Greg47]

To add to what mike said. Be sure (if you use 7x57 cases) to thin the rims from the front. Not the back. Also, Jr dies can be hard to find and expensive. I use jrs dies and take the expander button off. The 318 bullets seat and hold fine and shoot well in my 1944 sauer. That's using Norma JRS brass. Also I extend all my short shotgun chambers to use 2 3/4". Very little metal removed and lowers pressure. Esp if you cut long forcing cones at the same time.
Greg

[mike ford]

In my limited experience, so little has to be removed(specific to each gun) that most times you can thin from the rear and still have room to seat primers, without crushing. I, too use normal 8x57 dies this way. I can load with the same dies, 8x57 I, IR, IRS,8x72R, and 8x57R/360. When I aquire an 8x57 IS or 8x58 S&S, I intend to use the same dies.Only different shell holders, and maybe expander button( I bell with 32 S&W expander where necessary) are needed- of course this is mostly neck rather than FL sizing. It works like a charm.
Mike

[calumcrow]

I thought the 8x57JR ammunition was still available in Europe RWS, S&B ? I was lucky and managed to pick up 120 rounds of old stock RWS the first shop I tried
Calum

[Greg47]

Thx Mike

Does this mean that only Short 12ga can be used in the rifle?

I have been googling the world flat the last 24hrs and the history behind these drillings are amazing.

Easy to extend those chambers. And the 8x57jr is a fine caliber. Bullets easy to find here. Don't know about SA. I just use my jrs dies & brass and remove the expander button when resizing. Then the 318 bullets seat fine in the cases. One of my favorite drillings is a Jr. And I shoot it often.
Greg

[sharps4590]

RST I believe carries the 2 1/2 in. ammo and they're also easy to make by shortening 2 3/4 hulls and use a roll crimp tool from Ballistics Products. Alter the ammo, not the firearm.

[Tau]

Thanks guys for all the info. I pulled one bullet from a 7x57R round, but still it won't even chamber. Then I started looking for 8x57R cases, but in South Africa it seems like a rare find. In my search I found a Ferlach Drilling, the caliber is not yet know, but I suspect 16br and 7x57. So maybe I just sell the Kelber drilling and buy the Ferlach???

I don't want to destroy 80 RWS genuine rounds or my Drilling. I have no idea what the Kelber drilling is worth, but can get the Ferlach for $1500. What do you guys think?

I have enough modern rifles to shoot(hunting season starts next weekend for me, hunting some Springbok) so the drilling is safe for now.