Nagel & Menz Stalking Rifle

[algmule]

Hello
1919:
Zwermann, Jean, succ. de Nagel & Menz, 23, rue du Dome

Peter

[Leatherman]

One thing to add on your bullet choice. Take a fired case and find a bullet that will be a tight fit without sizing the case. Bore size is of no concern on most of these older Black powder rifles . Use a soft lead black powder bullet not the harder alloy as most commercial lead bullets being made today. You may half to cast your own. I have found on almost all my pre 1890’s rifles that the chambers necks are oversized compared to the bore. If you don’t fill the fired case neck the bullet will not be supported upon firing when the case neck expands. The bullet won’t enter the bore consistently straight causing deformation of the base which leads to unstable bullets. I had a terrible time getting my black powder rifles to shoot until I was educated about this. Also not all German rifles like heavy bullets for caliber as you find American and British rifles use. I found this out on double rifles getting them to regulate. Needed to go down to lighter pistol bullets . I have not encountered a choked barrel yet. I don’t know why the need or purpose of one in a cartridge gun.

[mike ford]

I agree with Leatherman's statement about filling the case neck. Sometimes though, you may not want to use black powder that obturates soft lead bullets and face the problem of not being able to chamber a cartridge with a bullet that fits the barrel. In such cases, you may be able to size the neck of a loaded cartridge with a bullet seated, thereby making a "heeled" bullet. I have encountered a few barrels that had tighter groove diameter at the muzzle than ahead of the chamber, usually by .003- ,005". I don't know if this is intentional "choking" or simply using the tighter end of an inconsistent barrel at the muzzle, in accordance with good gunsmithing practice. So far, I haven't encountered one proofed as a choked rifle barrel. From Leatherman's previous postings, he has considerably more experience with black powder than I and his suggestions may be better than mine.
Mike

[Axel E]

I have encountered a few barrels that had tighter groove diameter at the muzzle than ahead of the chamber, usually by .003- ,005". I don't know if this is intentional "choking"

It was intentional and often used in the 19^th century. Zimmer, 1872, who favored bore rifles like this 28g for hunting over “new-fangled small bores” like the .43 Mauser, mentioned “choked” rifle barrels favorably, while Koch, 1891, dismissed them as an useless idea. According to W.W. Greener the British muzzleloader .577 Enfield Rifled Musket, used with Minie type bullets, featured 3 grooves, .010” deep at the breech but only .005” at the muzzle. The same principle was followed by Alexander Henry when he designed his famous “Henry Rifling” as used in the .577-450 Martini-Henry rifle: 7 grooves, .009” deep at the breech and .007” at the muzzle. Additionally, Henry used a progressive rifling twist, increasing from one turn in 72” at the breech to 22” at the muzzle. The Suhl museum has an old rifling machine with two adjustable guide rails, a straight one for constant twist rates and a curved one for progressive twists.