Edgar Hubner

[R. Marshall]

This rifle chamber is really confusing.. I agree with Mike it maybe .32-40, but the cast has a shoulder. In the pictures it is not that noticeable but when you rub your fingers on the cast there is a definite shoulder. On the single shot assoc. forum some members are saying it is still chambered it the original 8.15x46r and to use the stop ring style bullet. A few say it's 8.15x52r with a stop ring bullet. I think they are basing it off the shoulder. I think the shoulder is to high for 8.15x46r. The shoulder looks to be in line with the 8.15x52r. Could it have been rechambered in Germany without getting reproofed? Could it have been rechambered in 8.15x52r in the states? Or is it rechambered in .32-40 but they didn't get the shoulder completely out? Or am I over analyzing the whole thing?

Thanks
Robert

[mike ford]

Robert,
All things are possible, I think the most likely is that it was rechambered to 32-40 and didn't quite clean up the old chamber. The 8.15x46R has a head diameter of about .427" and 32-40 would be about .422". Plus 8.15x46R has a slight shoulder, located where it might not quite clean up with a 32-40 reamer. The dimensions are not the same, but they are close enough that a 32-40 chamber should work fine. If you load it too hot, you might have a little "hitch" in extracting past the residual 8.15x46R shoulder, but that shouldn't happen with normal loads. My opinion is based on the unlikelyhood of an American gunsmith having an 8.15x52R reamer, and of a German gunsmith being willing to risk the trouble he could get into. Still, all things are possible and I wasn't there to know for sure.
Mike

[R. Marshall]

Mike I am truely grateful for your help. I went by my friends shop at lunch that I bought the rifle from and he had a old box of DOMINION 32-40 AMMO to do some comparing with.

[R. Marshall]

Mike here is a picture of the ammo that was built for this rifle. The empty brass was fired in this rifle. I have them pictured with a 32-40 round. The 32-40 does chamber but it felt a little loose I'm guessing because it doesn't have a shoulder.
Empty case
.3410” dia @ the case mouth
.4150” dia @ base above the rim
.3860” dia @ 1.30 starting below the rim
Case length is 52mm counting the rim.
The chamber cast is length is 53.56mm not including rim.

I slugged the bore and it came up same as cast
.3185
.3095

Grasping at straws: Could this rifle have been rechambered in 8.15x52r and confiscated before making it to the proof house?

My next step is to figure out what dies I need to make this brass.

[mike ford]

Robert,
Of course all things are possible and I don't have personal knowledge of what happened. After spending years "cobbling" together ammo for strange rifles I have a few ideas. The ammo you have that came with the rifle is shorter than 32-40 original length cartridges, because it was made with available cases, which happened to be 30-30 cases. By happenstance, 30-30 cases are about 52mm long. The length of your ammo was limited then, by the length of cases available for loading, and not by the length of the chamber. The 32-40 cartridge seemed "looser" than the ammo that came with the rifle, because it was factory new and unfired, whereas the handloaded ammo was put up in cases fireformed to your particular chamber( which is a little larger than a standard 32-40 chamber). To complicate understanding a little, original 32-40 and 38-55 cases were about 2.125-130" long. Your sample seems to be that length. The most current American 32-40 and 38-55 ammo was loaded in 30-30 length cases; so if you found and bought new 32-40 ammo, you would have ammo essentially the same as came with your rifle( except with a jacketed bullet and cases fireformed to your chamber). All these different length cases are safe, because they all headspace on the rim. Any dies that size what ever cases you decide to use enough to chamber can be used to make cases. Once you get the case into the chamber and fireformed, it can then be loaded by necksizing with any die that will size the neck of a similar length case to hold what ever bullet you intend to use( maybe 32 Win.Special w/o expander, or shortened 8mm Mauser die w/o expander, both adjusted to size neck only, if possible). I keep a 32-40 file trim die at hand and find it very handy while making up cases for strange calibers, from 6.5x58R S&S to 8x72R. You may find one handy also. As for cases, the choice is yours. The world is awash in 30-30 length cases and original 32-40/38-55 length cases are available from Starline. I hope you find some of this helpful.
Mike

[R. Marshall]

good info as always!! I will probably go with the little longer cases (32-40/38-55) when the time comes. I will use it for deer hunting. would a .318 cooper jacketed bullet be ok?

[mike ford]

Robert,
Yes a .318 copper jacketed bullet will be OK, one of the new flextip( .321") 32 Win. Special bullets might work and they have been getting good "press". If a .321" bullet will easily go into a fired, not resized, case, then it can be used. I'm sure one will go into one of the short cases, maybe the long cases also. These bullets weigh 165 grains.
Mike

[Axel E]

The chamber cast is length is 53.56mm not including rim.
Grasping at straws: Could this rifle have been rechambered in 8.15x52r and confiscated before making it to the proof house?

Very unlikely! The 8.15x52R was declared obsolete, out of print, no more available in1934 by the German ammunition factories. Your rifle was first proofed for the still common 8.15x46R two years later. A rechamber job to x52R just before confiscation, that is in 1945, makes no sense at all. Additionally, the gunsmith would have done a lousy job by cutting the chamber 3 mm too deep.
The rifle ended up in America post-WW2, where the 8.15x46R was unknown and unobtainable, but the (unknown in Germany) .32-40 was still availble.
Apply Occam's razor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor : Someone in the USA converted the rifle to use available American factory ammo. He ran a .32-40 reamer into the existing chamber. The straight taper .32-40 reamer did not clean up the slightly wider, bottlenecked 8.15x46R chamber, but the slight bulge did not matter. At least, it allowed using available American cartridges in an otherwise unuseable outlandish rifle.

[R. Marshall]

Very unlikely! The 8.15x52R was declared obsolete, out of print, no more available in1934 by the German ammunition factories. Your rifle was first proofed for the still common 8.15x46R two years later. A rechamber job to x52R just before confiscation, that is in 1945, makes no sense at all. Additionally, the gunsmith would have done a lousy job by cutting the chamber 3 mm too deep.
The rifle ended up in America post-WW2, where the 8.15x46R was unknown and unobtainable, but the (unknown in Germany) .32-40 was still availble.
Apply Occam's razor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor : Someone in the USA converted the rifle to use available American factory ammo. He ran a .32-40 reamer into the existing chamber. The straight taper .32-40 reamer did not clean up the slightly wider, bottlenecked 8.15x46R chamber, but the slight bulge did not matter. At least, it allowed using available American cartridges in an otherwise unuseable outlandish rifle.

Thanks Axel and Mike for all your help.

I really like this set up. I think it is my new favorite rifle.


Robert