Help IDing a Drilling

[mjwenzel]

Hello,

Last weekend my father-in-law handed down to my wife a Drilling his grandfather brought back from France after WWI. I had never seen one before and I think it's a remarkable gun. If you could help me figure out more of the story from some of the proof marks I'd be grateful. It has the G, U, and N under crowns; I understand these are the proofs for the rifle barrel, the side-by-side 16 gauge barrels, and that it had been tested with the "nitro" smokeless powder. It also has, in four lines:
8.6 m/m
72
10.20
434

I think the 8.6 mm and 72 are the rifle cartridge diameter and length; my guess is that 10.20 is October, 1920 as the date of the proof; and 434 would be a sort of serial number for that month. How am I doing so far?

Next to the crowned N are 3 marks:
A.W
F'G
11,6 gr

Now, the 11,6 gr is a charge or powder equivalent. Any tips on the other two? The F could be a capital E as well; and the mark that I've written as an apostrophe is a short horizontal line in the stamp instead of a vertical one.

There's also a stamp I can't read at all; and there are some shapes that look a bit like fringed shields.

Anyway, anything you can tell me about this gun's story would be appreciated. It's in pretty good shape, but shows signs of wear--I think it was used a lot, rather than collected and hung on a wall.

Thanks!
Mark

[mike ford]

Mark,
The 8.6 over 72 indicates the drilling is chambered for one of the 9.3x72Rs. Ammo for the "Normalized" version is avaliable in the US from a couple sources, J&G Sales seems to have the best price right now( Z&B brand). You are correct that the 10.20 is the date it was proofed, the 434 is the ledger number at the proofhouse. This date with the ledger number indicates it was proofed at Zella-Mehlis. If the word "nitro" is written in script,then this would be confirmed. The crown over G is the supplemenary mark for barrels firing solid projectiles(bullets). The crown over U is the "view proof"mark (a detailed inspection). The crown over N is nitro proof( for rifles,next to another crown). The 11.6 is actually the duty bullet weight. 11.6 grams of nitro powder would be an excessive load. The F'G is a misreading( likely due to wear) of the type of bullet. BlG is a lead bullet, KmG is a copper jacketed bullet, StG is a steel jacketed bullet. A bullet weight of 11.6 grams would be light for a lead bullet, so it is likely one of the other two. You didn't ask, but the shotgun barrels are chambered for 16ga 2 9/16" shells, unless it has been rechambered at some time( this is shown by the 16 in a circle).If it hasn't been rechambered, short shells are avaliable.There are others on this forum that are better versed in the other marks than I am. Just as an aside, a 1920 drilling seems a little late for a WW1 bringback.Was your father-in-laws grandfather in WWII or in WWI occupation?
I hope you find this helpful.
Mike

[C. Roger Bleile]

Unlikely a WWI bring-back as the doughboys did not invade or occupy Germany after WWI. Much more likely a WWII bring-back.

[Axel E]

Unlikely a WWI bring-back as the doughboys did not invade or occupy Germany after WWI.

Sorry, here you are wrong. After 1918 the allies France, Great Britain, Belgium and the USA occupied all German territories west of the Rhine plus 20 miles bridgeheads on the east bank. (The French originally wanted to push their border east to the Rhine for good) US troops were stationed in the Koblenz region from 1919 to 1923, when they gave their zone to the French and went home, as the US Congress rejected the Versailles "Peace Treaty". The French army stayed until June 1930. Though GIs did not "liberate" guns then, it is entirely possible a doughboy bought this drilling for a few dollars after 1920 and brought it home. Remember, the economy was broken up and any convertible currency was practically unavailable to Germans.

[mjwenzel]

Thanks for your help, gents. I did check with my father-in-law, and unfortunately there's no more information on the story, so we may never know exactly how it got here. If my choices are B|G, KmG, and StG, it'd have to be B|G. Any suggestions on where I could go to figure out the tiny A.W and the fringed shields (two on each barrel)?

Cheers,
Mark

[ellenbr]

Like to see the shields you mention. Looks like an encircled ML low on the rifled tube. I can't say if it would be for one of the Z-M mechanics or not. A.W. would be the tubeset knitter.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

[C. Roger Bleile]

Sorry, here you are wrong. After 1918 the allies France, Great Britain, Belgium and the USA occupied all German territories west of the Rhine plus 20 miles bridgeheads on the east bank. (The French originally wanted to push their border east to the Rhine for good) US troops were stationed in the Koblenz region from 1919 to 1923, when they gave their zone to the French and went home, as the US Congress rejected the Versailles "Peace Treaty". The French army stayed until June 1930. Though GIs did not "liberate" guns then, it is entirely possible a doughboy bought this drilling for a few dollars after 1920 and brought it home. Remember, the economy was broken up and any convertible currency was practically unavailable to Germans.

Axel,

Thanks for the information about WWI occupation by US troops. I learn something every day. I'm usually pretty knowledgable about WWI but the historians don't write much about what happens after a war ends. My father was in France from 1917 until 1919 but never got into Germany.

Roger