9.3x72R with Early German "D" Chamber

[cwbuff]

I have a 16x16x9.3 Heym Drilling, circa 1900. I believe the rifle is chambered in 9.3x72R with an early German "D" chamber. The newer 9.3x72R "normal" brass will not fit into the chamber (the breech will not close). I did a chamber casting and I am fairly confident that I have the chamber size correct. I would like to shoot the rifle. Does anyone know if reloading dies exist for this chamber? Does brass exist? I hate to modify this fine old gun, but I guess an option would be to ream the chamber to the normal chamber size. Thanks.

[sharps4590]

Mike, Axel or one of the other guys intimately familiar with the 9.3 X 72R will no doubt be along and I'm certain any of them can tell you what you need to know. I'm sorry I can't and that's one of the cartridges on my bucket list to work with.

[John]

I have a circa 1903 drilling in 9.3 x 72R. It's bore is gauged at 118.35.

I cannot close the action on an "old" RWS factory load that I picked up at a gun show. I think this round is the "normalized" type. I think the only dimensional problem is the thickness of the case rim, for I have some brass that came with the gun, and the rims are noticeable thinner than that RWS round.

Remove the barrels, and place the brass into the chamber. Apply some lamp black (coat the case with soot from a smokey candle flame). See where it rubs off. (It may just be the rim, like mine,,,)

[cwbuff]

If that is the case, what are the options? Is there a source of "thin rim" cases? Thanks.

[John]

I'm sure Mike Ford will have better answers than I, but here it goes...

My cases were trimmed from the front. Short of using a lathe, I have no clue how that is done. I read that one could remove metal from the back of the case/rim too. This does reduce the depth of the primer pocket. I think it was suggested that one could use pistol primers in this case, as they are not as "tall" as large rifle primers (and should be up for the modest pressures of 9.3 x 72 R).

One last option is to have the rim recess in your chamber cut slightly deeper (to accommodate the thicker rims of current cases), but personally, I hate to monkey around with a neat old gun.

[cwbuff]

The rim thickness did not occur to me. I did a quick check and that does look like the problem. The easiest solution is to find cases with slimmer rims (if they exist).

[sharps4590]

John is correct. I would take it off the front of the rim but I'm like Mike in that I believe a lathe is a necessity regardless of how many years I went without one. I think Mike and others have removed brass from the base of the cartridges without ill result, also essentially what John said. I don't know if he's done it on the lathe or has some other method. A lathe makes the most sense.

Hopefully you will be able to find some cases with thinner rims.

[cwbuff]

I'm will start looking at the next gun show. I have a new Norma case that is too thick to compare things with. My Heym Drilling is SN 2822 and has two 16 gauge shotgun barrels marked "Krupp Scher / Prima / Gewehrlauf-Stahl" Is there an accurate way to date the gun?

[John]

Post close, detailed pictures of all of the little proof marks on the "flats" on the underside of the breech end of the barrel assembly, as well as the markings on the rifle barrel (also at breech end). Obviously, you'll have to take the forearm off, and then remove the barrels. There should be letters, crowns, numbers, things that look like eagles or "crushed bugs." We should be able to tell the month & date of proof, especially if proofed in Z-M.

[Axel E]

My Heym Drilling is SN 2822 and has two 16 gauge shotgun barrels marked "Krupp Scher / Prima / Gewehrlauf-Stahl" Is there an accurate way to date the gun?

To date the gun, post photos of all the proof- and other marks under the barrels. As there were no less than 47 gunmakers named Heym active in Suhl one time or another, post the full "Heym" inscription too.
"Krupp Scher / Prima / Gewehrlauf-Stahl" translates: Best barrel steel by the Krupp steelworks in Essen. A common inscription on barrels.

[cwbuff]

Here is the Heym Inscription. I will need to take some pictures of the other markings/proofs this weekend.
DSC_0028.jpg

[John]

BTW: If you DO find a source of thin-rimmed cases, please let me know !

Thanks !

John

[cwbuff]

I will do that. I'm going to go back to square one and remeasure the chamber casting and see if I can determine what it is chambered in. The rifle barrel is marked "118/35" (I will take pictures tomorrow). I have two cases. The Norma 9.3x72R will not seat into chamber. It protrudes about 1/2". The Norma 9.3x74R drops right in, but the rim is clearly too thick to close the breech.

[Axel E]

I will do that. I'm going to go back to square one and remeasure the chamber casting and see if I can determine what it is chambered in. The rifle barrel is marked "118/35" (I will take pictures tomorrow). I have two cases. The Norma 9.3x72R will not seat into chamber. It protrudes about 1/2". The Norma 9.3x74R drops right in, but the rim is clearly too thick to close the breech.

IMHO you have a 9.3x72R Sauer & Sohn. This case is just like the 9.3x74R, just two mm shorter and with a thinner rim.

[cwbuff]

The Drilling has external hammers and a Greener breech. Here are the pictures of the markings. I have larger ones available if needed. From what I can tell, these are the main markings (not counting the "smashed bugs" that I can see:
Receiver: Crown U
Rifle barrel: Crown G, 118/35 (there is also what looks like a script F.H. and an "L.K."
Shotgun Barrels: Crown S, Crown W, 16 in a circle, 2 g Sch. PNA / 27 G Bl
DSC_0001.jpgDSC_0002.jpgDSC_0016.jpgDSC_0020.jpg