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I am looking at an unnamed German drilling 16g over 8X72 . Is ammunition available for this caliber ? The gun is engraved with a bullet trap and standard wood
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Meinherr,
Ammunition is available custom loaded by Buffalo Arms, as I recall; but it costs well over $100 a box. I load my own and it really is no harder than loading anything else. I size 9.3x72R cases in a 32-40 file trim die as far as the case will go (the 9.3 case is a little larger than 32-40) and trim to the"trim to" length, I think 2.85". Fire form and load as usual, using .318" bullets. I just neck size using normal 8mm Mauser dies, set higher in the press and without the expander. The seater is set the same way. It works like a charm. BTW, 8x72R is a pretty good cartridge.
Mike -
Thanks MikeComment
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You are welcome.Comment
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The auction house is now saying it is a 8.8X72 which they say is a 9.3X72 ? is that correct?
Thanks
DougComment
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Doug,
Yes, 8.8x72 is one of the proof marks you find on 9.3X72R rifles. That mark is not really the nominal cartridge designation, it only shows the bore (not bullet or groove) diameter and case length. The "R" is not marked because whether the cartridge is rimmed or rimless is self-evident from the extractor. Ammo for the normalized (standardized) version of 9.3x72R available from S&B and is much cheaper than custom loaded 8x72R.
MikeComment
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The auction house house says the only marks are Krupp Stahl and 8.8X72. No proof marks and no 16 G indications etc or STGM marks . Could be an unfinished gun with no makers name or manufacture date but looks like a gun from the 30s with a horn trigger guard , heavy engraving and bullet trapComment
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Were there different case sizes in the 9.3X72 ? like the 8X57 360 Sauer? So this is not a 8X72 R?
DougComment
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Doug,
I don't have the gun "in Hand" like the auction house does, so I can't say what is on the gun and what is not. Since it is marked 8.8x72 it has been to the proof house. The Krupp Stahl mark was applied by the maker and shows what type of steel the barrels are made from, it is more or less an advertising mark, not a proof mark. The lack of a maker or dealer's mark likely means it was a gun made for "the trade" and not marked by the dealer. It is not an 8x72R, according to the marking. The 8x57R/360 is a bottle necked cartridge and is not a Sauer Item, the closest Sauer Cartridge is the 8x58R S&S. There are two "sizes" of 9.3x72R, one is based on The British 360 2 1/4" .427-433" headsize and the other is the rare 9.3x72R S&S which is about a .473" headsize cartridge. Within the .360 size there are various case forms the most prominent being the "E" (English) version, "D" (Deutsche), "N" (Normal. - standardized) versions. The "N" version was standardized to make a version that would encompass most of the other case form dimensions of the other versions. The modern ammunition you can buy today is this version. The common pre 1912 and post 1911 proof marks showing bore diameter in Gauge measurement or bore diameter and case length in mm do not differentiate between the different versions of case forms. Rifles made for the different versions of the 360 headsize could be, and many were, rechambered to the "N" version and rifles were later made in that version. It was not necessary to re-prove the rechambered rifles because the various versions were proofed at the same pressure. Every once in a while, we see guns that have had the proof marks removed during re-bluing in the USA, because some Americans do not understand the markings and think they are ugly. It is not possible to give a precise answer, with so little information.
Mike
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Thankyou. I learned a lot about a complicated process. . So it was common practice to have the dealer to mark the barrels ,gauges chamber size etc and date stamps ?Comment
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Doug,
No, it was common practice for dealers to buy guns made for "the trade" without a maker's name and the dealer sometimes added their name and sometimes not. The proof house measured the barrels after proofing and verified dimensions, marked the diameters, chamber lengths, and whether they were proofed for shot or a single projectile and applied the appropriate marks. To sell a gun that was not appropriately proofed, within country, was/is a violation of law.
MikeComment
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Thankyou for the clarificaionComment
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