My new single shot

[John]

Here are some pics of my latest find (8.15 x 46 R).

Interesting that it was first proofed in January 1903 (with a 25 cal bore) and then proofed two months later with a 30 cal bore. (See pics)

The number 27 appears on the barrel & on the front of the receiver (an assembly number ?) Also, many of the parts have a capital H stamped on them. Does the HS stamped on the underside of the barrel hint to any known maker/barrel maker ?

Also note the service load markings. 0.6 gr. l r.B.P. and 5 gr Bl What is l r. B. P. ? (Is there a Gothic "D" stamped top the left of these markings ???)

This is the first time I saw the word "fest" used to indicate the "safety" is on. (Common ?)

See the cocking indicator. Under DRGM, there is an odd symbol. Any ideas ?

I like the "Bavarian-style" cheek piece. Really neat !

Is there any easy way to remove the barrel assembly from the receiver ? I thought it would come off in the same manner as most German break-open guns...


So, any thoughts, comments, ideas as to possible makers, etc. would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks !

John

[John]

Here are some more pictures...IMG_9704.jpgIMG_9706.jpgIMG_9707.jpg

[John]

Three more pictures...IMG_9708.jpgIMG_9709.jpgIMG_9710.jpg

[algmule]

Hello

Isn't the EB trademark for Emil Barthelmes?

Kind regards
Peter

[mike ford]

John,
This is a pretty popular type rifle, usually chambered for smaller cartridges, up to 9.3x72R. The 8.15x46R seems to be about the most common. They were finished and sold by several different shops, but except for the Sauer Tell model, the actions seem to be the product of some factory in Zella-Mehlis. The 0,6 gr.lr BP stands for 0.6 grams( they used a , instead of .)(9.3 grains) of some type flake powder( B- blattchen, P- pulver). I don't know this powder, but Axel may. The 5 gr. Bl stands for a 5 gram (72.2 grain) lead ( Blei) bullet. This powder and bullet weight is likely for what ever the original 25 cal ( 6.5mm) cartridge was ( possibly 6.5x27R Einzelladerbuechse- single shot rifle). I have never seen "fest" used for a safety, either. I guess it means "fastened" or "fixed". Note that to fire the rifle you have to pull the safety rearward, this is common on this type rifle. Peter answered for the EB mark, but it is not known which feature it is for. There are a couple different methods of barrel removal seen with this type rifle. I didn't see a screw slot, so I think yours is one with a hinge pin that drives out. It would be driven in from right to left, so it would come out left to right. When you reinstall it, check if one end is larger than the other( taper pin).
Mike

[JDL]

Nice rifle John.

[algmule]

Hello

John,

To the furthest left of the load marking I would say is a badly stamped/worn crown, and to the right of that worn crown I suspect is a letter.

As for the "lr." I recently saw that on the rifle barrel of a Frank-Drilling. The marking on that barrel was "1 g lr. B.P." and "9 g Bl." and to the left of these markings was a crown F. The barrel was also marked "313.", so some 6,5. I don't know what "lr." stands for and I wouldn't dare a guess that the illegible letter on your rifle is an F.

Kind regards
Peter (a.k.a. "this dude")

[Axel E]

Peter is right: The rifle was made by or for Emil Barthelmes, Meininger Str. 11, Zella – Mehlis, founded 1854, as shown by their EB mark. Until 1913 the company was run by Hubertus Barthelmes. I found no DRGM in the name of Barthelmes regarding this type of rifle, nor a Z-M barrelmaker HS. As thes simple "Tell – type" break open rifles were a staple of the Z – M guntrade, HS may stand for an outworking actioner too, but there were many HS gunsmithes working in the guntrade there.
Mike is spot on guessing at the 6.5x27R as the original chambering. If you read the "Ir" as a misstamped or worn off "Tr", the service load info makes sense: It reads 0.6 gramm Troisdorfer Büchsenpulver = 9.25 gr (smokeless) rifle powder by the factory in Troisdorf and a 5 g = 77 gr bullet. By the 1930s the RWS and DWM factory 6.5x27R load was .5 g T(roisdorfer) 1912 powder and a 5.3 g copper jacket bullet.
Apparently something was wrong with the original bore, or there was an urgent order for a 8.15x46R, so the barrel was rebored, rerifled, rechambered and reprofed almost immediately.
"Fest" means "solid, firm, blocked" in German. I have rarely seen it on gun safeties, but by 1903 the word "sicher" = safe was not "fest" established.

[John]

Why didn't they stamp a new service load after the reboring/rechambering ? (Just curious...)

This is now my favorite gun. It is so light & trim ! The older I get, the more I appreciate light guns. I bought loaded ammo from Buffalo Arms that shoots well (a 160 grain stop-ring lead bullet). It's a nice gun ! I hope to hunt deer with it.......some day...

To all: Thank you so much for all of your insights/knowledge ! This group is a treasure trove of information !!!!


Thanks again, and if don't post in the interim, may you all have a very Merry Christmas & a blessed new year !

[sharps4590]

That is one nice rifle!

[chapmen]

[chapmen]

I am wondering about the word "Fest" at the safety lever. Never seen this, and it make no sense for the safety.

How is the other position marked?

There are two positions?

Do you have tryed to remove the barrel when "Fest" is not visible?

[John]

The other position (of the safety) is unmarked. From what I observed (and from what I have been told here), the barrel cannot be removed from the receiver without first removing (drifting) the hinge pin. The safety does indeed prevent the gun from being fired when the word "Fest" is exposed.