Hofbüchsenmacher Gustav Schäfer?

[algmule]

Hello

A Norwegian gentleman seeks information on Gustav Schäfer, "Hofbüchsenmacher T[h]üringen". Also, if the Drilling is proofed around 1912 using two different systems of markings?? Here are the images:


Rifle barrel is Krupp steel. It has not yet been confirmed that it is a 8x72R. Another five images in the next post.

Kind regards
Peter

[algmule]

Hello

Tried to work a bit on the images. I don't know if it turned out any better. While I was doing it I noticed the thing has a crown R so at some point it was re-proofed. I couldn't delete the images from my first post - second post I was allowed - so I'm just going to post the whole lot - hopefully slightly improved - again. Sorry.
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Kind regards
Peter

[algmule]

Hello

Five further images:
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Kind regards
Peter

[mike ford]

Peter,
If no one has addressed this when I get back from Dr. I will try then.
Mike

[algmule]

Hello

It's a 20 gauge and the rifle barrel is some 8 mm. It has two serials(?). The chambers of the shot tubes are not shorter than 65 mm. Shot tubes are Witten Excelsior steel. It has markings from two periods, Nitro and mm points to post 1912 but 2,3 g G.B.P/S.t.m.G points to pre 1912 I assume. Perhaps the reproof was about changing from one 8 mm cartridge to another - to x72. I don't know which 8 mm would have been the original if so. And where is the original gauge marking on the rifle barrel if the barrel set is the one the thing was born with pre 1912. Two serials(?) - perhaps a new barrel set. As I'm not the owner and rely on other people's images I have not been able to identify the initials in that marking. Anyway, it's a beautiful Drilling and I would like to own it. Lottery was, however, no help.

I've tried to find a Gustav Schäfer, Hofbüchsenmacher in T[h]üringen but no luck. So I tried listings for Schaefer and Schaeffer but zilch came up.

If I'm unusually incomprehensible today it's because I've hardly seen a drop of rain for three months and the heat is beginning to take its toll. It's already seven days into fox season and I dare not enter the woods and I've got a new toy - a Drilling - to try out. Roebuck season is only nine days away and there is no sign of rain.

EDIT: perhaps the things was proofed when the post 1912 system of markings hadn't yet set in. Also, I've purchased another share in the lottery!

Kind regards
Peter

[Axel E]

Gustav Schäfer was not in Thüringen, a mere geographical region pre-WW1, but in Tübingen, a traditional university town in Würtemberg. south-western Germany. Mentioned around 1900, he was labeled gunmaker to the court of the King of Würtemberg.
It's not unusual to find guns with post-1912 Suhl proofmarks and the older service charge markings. Apparently there was some time of overlap. I tend to date the drilling 1912. The 8x72R was the first cartridge "invented " by Wilhelm Brenneke in 1898, meant as an improvement over the 8x58R S&S.
"Excelsior" was a high grade barrel steel by the Witten steelworks. Louis Berger in Witten on Ruhr pioneered the making of small arms barrel steel in the 1850s, while Krupp concentrated on artillery until the 1890s. Witten had virtually a monopoly on barrel steel during the 1860s – 70s, exporting worldwide. They even made a special order barrel steel stock, almost 2" thick, for one of their major American customers: Colt in Hartford, Conn.
Peter mentions two serial numbers, but I can make out only one, 174 S. This may be Schäfer's own serial number, while another one may be of the real Suhl maker. Sorry, but I can not read the initials in the photos.
The shot barrels are certainly chambered for 20g 2 ½" = 65 mm shells, not the now common 2 ¾" = 70mm ones.

[algmule]

Hello

Axel,
thanks. You have a PM from me. Here is the other serial. It's either 666 or 999.

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Kind regards
Peter

[algmule]

Hello

Here he is, in 1914:
"Schäfer, Gustav, Kgl. Hofbüchsenmacher, Schwärzlocherstraße 7", Tübingen

Kind regards
Peter

[mike ford]

Peter,
In my experience, if a gun had more than one barrel set both(or all) carried the same serial number. I, too, am limited by available photos, but my impression is the 666 (or 999) is not in a typical location for serial numbers. I think it could be a "touchmark" identifying one of the workmen. If the rifle was rechambered to 8x72R, I wonder about the lack of "repair" or re-proof. Even though required, I wouldn't say rechambered drillings were always re proofed. As always, I could be wrong.
Mike

[Axel E]

I think the drilling was chambered and proofed originally for Brenneke's 8x72R cartridge. The 72 wwas stamped later by another, just for clarification. Marking the case length with the proofmarks came into common use in 1925, many years after this drilling was made.