Looking for Obsolete Cartridges

[Williamgeorge]

My 1925 -1930 era Robert Schrader made cape gun takes 9.3x 82R ammunition. Does anyone have a source for cartridges or brass? I'm in the process of refurbishing both sets of barrels, travel case, etc. Before I pass the gun on to a nephew I want to provide a fully functioning weapon. Thanks for any information.

[Diz]

Graf & Sons has Bertram 9.3x82R brass in stock. Pretty pricey but you'll have the right stuff with the correct head stamp. Diz

[mike ford]

It's not the best solution, but some people shoot 9.3x72R ammo in the longer chamber.
Mike

[Williamgeorge]

Thank you for the suggestion - I just ordered a box of twenty. Pricey but for an heirloom so it is easy to justify. Now I need to locate Suhl type claw foot rings for a period scope........ the fun of the hunt.

[Williamgeorge]

Thanks but I opted for the 9.3x 82R brass from Graf. I wonder about the .22 short vs .22 LR analogy in heavier calibers.....

[mike ford]

Williamgeorge,
People that can't afford or don't have the skill to acquire 9.3x82R ammo are the ones that use 9.3x72R. Since you are well on your way to loading proper ammo, this wouldn't apply to you. Modern 9.3x72R ammo( I believe) is loaded to a higher level than original 9.3x82R, the .22 short vs. 22 LR analogy doesn't exactly apply then. Take note of the fact that it is highly unlikely that you will be able to find rings that fit your rifle. They are hand fit to a particular rifle/scope combination and are in no way "standard" parts, if bought used. You will be much better off having someone with access to new parts either do the work for you, or sell you new parts to do it yourself. Good luck.
Mike

[Williamgeorge]

Hello Mike! Thanks for your insight. Safer all around to stick with the right brass. My impression is that these era rifles are not used that much so twenty cartridges should be a good start along with a case of 2 1/2" shotgun shells. I understand about the scope rings. And the other barrel set of ss 2x12 gauge apparently needs to be relined unfortunately. What I am trying to achieve is a usable 1930 s era rifle/shotgun with period scope that will stay in the family for generations. Without getting a second mortgage of course.....Hope you are having a great Christmas season. George

[cotis]

George,
Sounds like an interesting rifle. I have never heard of 9.3x82R before, learned something new today I know your dilemma regarding the scope and rings, I had the same issue a few months ago. I acquired an older Zeiss 4x rail-mounted scope and purchased several sets of claw mounts from Ebay Germany. I was VERY fortunate that the front mount from one set and the rear mount from the other were the perfect height for application. I was prepared to remake the rear claws if necessary to obtain the correct height and fit. there are still other issues to contend with, such as the angle of the claws (tapered in or tapered out depending on an over/under or side-by-side barrel configuration) and more importantly the curvature mating surfaces of the front claw mount. The base and mount are made as a matched set, formed together under great pressure to obtain a perfect line-to-line fit. A new claw mount will never be absolutely "perfect" to a front base, but it can be done if you are patient enough. It took me the better part of a weekend to fit the mounts to my rifle and I am very happy with the results. It is easy to see how the costs for properly fitted set run $800-$1200 from NECG.

[sharps4590]

I bought two boxes of the 9.3 X 82R from Graf's to make my 9.3 X 75R Nimrod. Expensive yes but it works correctly....after some creative sizing thanks to suggestions from Mike.

[Williamgeorge]

Hello! Thanks for relating your experience re: claw mounts from Germany. i don't think I would have the confidence to try German Ebay. On the other hand I have good friends from Limburg Germany visiting me now. They will be heading home the 31st and I am sure I can get my friend to visit his local gunsmiths enquiring about mounts. i have very good photos with accurate measurements of the barrels and receptacles (rigid front, spring loaded rear) he can take along. Think it is possible to buy with some confidence this way? This rifle/shotgun looks like a typical SxS boxlock Browning classic when viewed in profile. I don't doubt your estimate for NECG.....

[mike ford]

The first question your friend will be asked is which model scope you intend to mount. They will need the actual diameter of the objective bell, the diameter of the tube, the location of the adjustment turret . The location of the existing bases was set to fit the original scope, and may not be adaptable to your scope, without using extended ring(s)( the front ring must be near the front of the scope to allow "tipping", to install or remove it. Care must also be taken to insure the turret doesn't interfere with the rear ring. All the while, it must be located to insure a useable eye relief.) You will need an appropriate( height, dia., type) front ring, which will come with a "foot plate" that fits the "claws", but it needs to be large enough to be fit to the existing dovetailed base. You should ask for appropriate rear ring that has adjustment( "mit support") and is long enough ( without the "claws" being milled already) to allow it to be fit to an existing base. You should also get a new "slider", because the existing one has already been filed on the bottom in the original fitting. It wouldn't be a bad idea to buy a couple extra springs, while you are at it. There are several different firms that make these parts, the gunsmith your friend goes to will have his favorite, so you won't need to select the maker.
There is another option, that would be easier and a little cheaper, but would not technically be claw mounts. Ernst Apel Wuerzburg (EAW) has a system to convert claw mount bases to use "swing mount" rings. This is easier and avoids the problem of having to tip the scope. They have different options for locking the rear ring, one of which allows preserving the ability to return to the original claw mount bases. In my discussions with Eric Recknagel (ERA), I discovered he very often adopted other firm's good ideas and made copies. He has since passed away and his daughter has moved the company to a new location. She may very well offer a similar system, and it is worth asking about. Another difference between claw mounts and EAW's system, is that EAW's is adjustable by different thickness spacers, so all is not lost if you make a mistake. Good luck.
Mike

[Williamgeorge]

Thanks Mike Ford! I think I'm going to gift the gun, new case, brass for rifle and a case of 2 1/2 shells to my nephew and let him deal with a scope if HE WANTS ONE - You make it pretty clear that fitting a scope to an elderly weapon like this one is a lot more complicated than doing the same to a modern rifle. By doing this I can move on and pursue my own interests and find something particular to me for range work. Have a great Christmas!

[mike ford]

Williamgeorge,
I'm sure your nephew will be thrilled. You would have fun with it, but I'm sure his young eyes can handle open sights. Enjoy whatever you move to. Thanks and I hope you and your family have a Merry Christmas also.
Mike