New Member Who Inherited Sauer Und Sohn Shotgun

[HerbertI]

My uncle, who was in WWII, confiscated this shotgun from the Germans. It's a 12 gauge, 30" barrel. It had to be manufactured before 1944, but shows no date on the barrel. It looks like walnut stock, but I'm not sure of the wood. The plating around the trigger area is engraved with ducks, dog and a partridge. The serial number is 223564. It also says Special Krupp Gewehr-Lauf-Stahl. It's in excellent working condition. I would appreciate any information and approximate worth. More detailed photos are in My Profile in My Album.

Thank you

[ellenbr]

Are you sure it is not dated? It should be from circa 1923. Shuck the forend and show the marks and pay close attention either on the underside of the left flat or just forward of the flats.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

[HerbertI]

Raimey, Thanks I got out a magnifying glass and found the following: number on the barrel 223564 then a crown with cross over capital S. On the flat parts the figure of a knight with shield and spear and "M", another crown with "W" Then "U" under which there is 13/1 followed by a 12 inside a circle. One side adds a 11/81. and Nitro I still see nothing looking like a date. There are new photos in my album, too. I made it available to the public. Adding photos to the right place is difficult on this website.

HerbertI

[mike ford]

HerbertI,
The crown over S means the barrels were proofed for shot,crown W means the barrel is choked(likely pretty tight),the U indicates the view proof( a detailed inspection).The"knight" with spear and shield(or caveman or barbarian ?)is I believe a makers mark. The 12 inside a circle means it is chambered for 12ga 65mm(2 9/16") shells, unless the chamber has been lengthened to 70mm(2 3/4") and not marked. The 13/1 is the diameter of the barrel ahead of the chamber, expressed in ga.measurement(about 18.26mm).I think the "11/81"is likely the date, but 81 wouldn't be appropriate.Check again under good light with magnification to see if it is actually 31 instead.I couldn't call up the new photos. BTW,glad to have youas a new menber.If your uncle is still living, it would be interesting to learn the circumstances of how he managed to save this fine old gun and send it back. Many were destroyed by the allies and are now lost to everyone.It isn't often that we can learn how these guns were saved,first hand, from the person that actually did it. Also, be sure to thank him for his service.
Mike

[HerbertI]

Sauer Und Sohn Markings

Mike,

Thanks for your detailed response. The new photos are in my album which I made available to the public. The first one shows all these markings in more detail. Is it possible that the shot gun was made in 1881?

[ellenbr]

No, that's 11/23 with ledger number 81. Many say that Suhl did not use a ledger number and it was only Zella Mehils. But I contend that for a time from September 1923 till say April of 1924 that Suhl did indeed use a ledger and this Sauer is yet another example. So it was proofed in November 1923, a month or so after Suhl began using a dating scheme.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

[ellenbr]

I forgot to note it looks to be a Modell 8E(with ejectors) and game scene engraving. Also note the large crown forward on the left flat which signifies either quality or shooting performance.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

[HerbertI]

Sauer Und Sohn Markings

Mike, My uncle is long dead, but since his first language as a second generation immigrant was German, he was used to detect infiltrators during the Battle of the Bulge. He confiscated a number of shotguns from German officers and gave one to each of his brothers including my father. I first saw it in 1944 or 45 and inherited it from my father. My uncle was also present at the liberation of one of the death camps and showed us the photos he took there. Those were very shocking to me as a boy of 10.

I may be interested in selling this shotgun, does anyone have an estimate of its worth? HerbertI.

[mike ford]

HerbertI,
I normally don't give estimates of value, but in this case it's easy. The gun is priceless to your family,keep it and if you don't want it, pass it on to a family member that does; and pass your uncle's story on also.
Mike

[Jim Cate]

From the photos it would appear to be a Model 17 based on the amount of "game scene" engravings and the type of barrel steel that was used. By the serial number, 223564, it probably was made in 1923 or 1924. Regards, JIM