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I have an old Austrian "Buechsflinte" 16 / 11.15 X 58R Austrian Werndl. I did a cerrocast and sluged the bore at .458 groove dia. The cerrocast suggests that is is the above cartrige. Can anyone please advise me further information?
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wrnothstine,
I think you have an interesting project on your hands. The 11.15x58 R Werndl was a military cartridge used in some Werndl and Mannlicher rifles. You may find some ammunition listed under "collector's ammo" headings. If so you will quickly decide it is too dear to shoot. This makes it pretty much a handloading operation to shoot it. If you want to take this on, we will do everything we can to help you out. With a groove diameter of .458", you would think bullets would be a "snap". However, both the 11.15x58R and the other Werndl cartridge, 11.4x50R, were loaded with a smaller bullet. They worked because they were dead soft bullets and the blackpowder propellant caused them to "slug up", expand to fit the barrel. I personally avoid blackpowder, but a couple others on this site have no problems with it. The problem( other than useable cases) will likely be that a cartridge loaded with a grove diameter( or .002" over) bullet will not chamber. I have a similar situation with my M71 11.15x60R Mauser. I solve this by sizing the necks of loaded cartridges, thereby effectively making the .452" bullets into "heeled" type bullets. Cases will be another challenge. Modern 50-110 Winchester (Starline) cases can be adapted, with a good bit of work. This would include sizing the caseheads to fit the chamber, trimming to length, necking down, and converting the rims to "Mauser Base" type. It is possible that cases can be purchased that can be used, but will be expensive. BTW, the 16 ga. chambers will be found to be 65mm long rather than the current standard 70mm( 2 3/4"). Ammo for the shotgun will not be nearly the problem that the rifle will. It will be more of an inconvenience than a problem. If you decide you want to go through all this, let us know and we can help you. To do this we will need the dimensions of your chamber, as measured from the chambercast.
Mike -
wrnothstine,
Welcome to the club I think you will enjoy it.
Mike is right on all counts with this cartridge and there is plenty of help around here. I am sure "Sharps" will check in on this and he is the black belt of black powder. You already have most of the important information and it would be good to post some pictures of the gun showing all the stamping if possible. A photo or drawing of the chamber cast along with the dimensions would be a great help.
Thanks, DizComment
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An another welcome!! This is an amazing site. Things are moving a little slow right now but once a thread gets going there is a great deal of knowledge to be derived. I've not worked with the Werndl cartridge so can't offer anything regarding it. If you decide to try black powder and cast bullets I expect that a suitable load can be developed. Might have to jump through some hoops but from what Mike posts one might have to do that with smokeless powder also. But that's what makes it fun!!! Anyone can go to Wally World and BUY ammo.....how distressing and boring that is....
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